Śrīla Prabhupāda Speaks Out
How to Find Perfect Knowledge in an Imperfect World
This conversation between His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda and physicist Gregory Benford took place in October, 1973, at the Los Angeles Kṛṣṅa center.
Dr. Benford: You are probably familiar with what Western theology calls "the problem of evil": Why does evil exist?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: Evil is the absence of good, just as darkness is the absence of sunlight. If you keep yourself always in the light, where is the question of darkness? God is all-good. So if you keep yourself always in God consciousness, then there is no evil.
Dr. Benford: But why was the world created with evil men?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: Why was the police department created? Because there is a necessity. Similarly, some living entities want to enjoy this material world; therefore God creates it. He is just like a father who gives a separate room to his mischievous children to play in. Otherwise, the naughty boys would always disturb him.
Dr. Benford: This world, then, is something like a prison?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: Yes, it is' a prison. Therefore, there is suffering here. In the prison house you cannot expect comfort, because unless there is suffering, there is no lesson for the prisoners. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam: Duḥkhālayam means "the place for suffering." And aśāśvatam means "temporary." You cannot make a compromise and say, "All right, I am suffering, but I don't care about that—I shall remain here." You cannot remain here; you will be kicked out. Now you are thinking that you are an American, you are a great scientist, you are happy, you are getting a good salary.... That's all right, but you cannot stay in this post. The day will come when you will be kicked out. And you do not know whether you are going to be an American or a scientist or a cat or dog or demigod. You do not know.
Dr. Benford: I think that I will probably be nothing.
Śrīla Prabhupāda: No, that is another kind of ignorance. Kṛṣṅa explains in the Bhagavad-gītā [2.12], dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā / tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ: first you are in the body of a boy, then a young man, and in the future you will be in the body of an old man—
Dr. Benford: But after I'm an old man I might be nothing.
Śrīla Prabhupāda: No, no. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ: after death you will pass into another body. So. you cannot say, "I am going to be nothing." Of course, you may say anything, but the laws are different. You may know the law, or you may not know the law. It doesn't matter—the law will act. For example, if you think, "I will touch the fire—it will not burn me," that is not a fact. It will burn. Similarly, you may think there is nothing after death, but it is not a fact.
Dr. Benford: Why does a person like me—someone who's trying to understand the world rationally—seem to find no way in which to do it?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: You are trying to know things rationally, but you are not going to the proper teacher.
Dr. Benford: But I feel that by studying the world I can acquire knowledge, and there is a way to check that knowledge. You formulate hypotheses, you perform experiments, you verify your ideas, and then you see if you can use these ideas in the practical world.
Śrīla Prabhupāda: That is one more kind of ignorance—because you do not know that you are imperfect.
Dr. Benford: Oh, I know that I'm not perfect.
Śrīla Prabhupāda: Then what is the use of your trying to study the world this way and that way? If you are imperfect, the result will be imperfect.
Dr. Benford: That's true.
Śrīla Prabhupāda: So why waste your time?
Dr. Benford: But there doesn't seem to be any other way of finding knowledge.
Śrīla Prabhupāda: Even for material knowledge, you have to go to the university and consult a professor. Similarly, when you want to learn spiritual knowledge—perfect knowledge—you have to approach a perfect teacher. Then you will get perfect knowledge.
Dr. Benford: But how does one know when the teacher is perfect?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: It is not difficult. A perfect teacher is one who has learned from another perfect teacher.
Dr. Benford: But that merely removes the problem a step.
Śrīla Prabhupāda: No, because there is one perfect teacher—Kṛṣṅa—who is accepted by all classes of teachers. In India we still find the Vedic culture, which is taught by Vedic scholars. And all these Vedic teachers accept Kṛṣṅa as the supreme teacher. They take lessons from Kṛṣṅa and teach that.
Dr. Benford: So anyone I meet who accepts Kṛṣṅa as the perfect teacher—he is a perfect teacher?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: Yes. Anyone who is teaching the teachings, of Kṛṣṅa—he is a perfect teacher.
Dr. Benford: Then all the devotees here are perfect teachers?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: Yes, because they are teaching only Kṛṣṅa's teachings, that's all. They may not be perfect. But whatever they are speaking is perfect, because it is taught by Kṛṣṅa.
Dr. Benford: Then you are not perfect?
Śrīla Prabhupāda: No, I am not perfect. None of us claim that we are perfect—we have so many defects. But because we don't speak anything beyond Kṛṣṅa's teachings, our teaching is perfect. We are just like a postman who brings you a money order for one thousand dollars. He is not a rich man, but if he delivers to you the envelope as it is, you are benefited. He is not a rich man, but his perfect dealing—his honest dealing—is perfect. Similarly, we are not perfect; we are full of imperfections. But we don't go beyond the teachings of Kṛṣṅa—that is our process—and therefore our teachings are perfect.